[superoilhunter]

After reading through the boards... NYC has much stricter laws, I'm not sure what I can buy and what I can't... I'm so lost.
What is a good shotgun for home defense.. something easy, quick to load and easy/nothing to maintain for a newbie. Pleaseeee help. Thank you so much.

 

[Darthgamer138]

Do you have your NYC rifle/shotgun permit?

 

[superoilhunter]

Do you have your NYC rifle/shotgun permit?

yes... just got it after 5 months of waiting! Now I'm looking for a shotgun.. but have no clue! -_-

 

[MDX]

This has been beaten to death on here. Run a search you find 100s of suggestions. Makes models, legalities, opinions and options.

Best bet is go to one of the local gun shops to NYC. They cater to this ..... same state but "upstaters" have more choices then NYC residents.

 

[Darthgamer138]

That would be the best bet. Go see a few and if you have questions on those models ask. NYC has very weird restrictions that we do not, so if we recommended something it may be illegal there. I think even their pump shotguns have a 5 round magazine limit.

 

[stevec]

visit mossbergs website and look at the 500. just remember no folding stocks and i think pistol grips are a no-no. magazine cannot hold anymore than 5 rounds meaning you can get a 5 (magazine)+1(chamber)

I just got a Benelli Nova tactical which is my new HD gun. My mossberg 835 is back to a hunting only role.

you can shop the Gander mtn in middletown just know what you can purchase before you go.

 

[Guest]

If I may, for the apartment dweller in NYC, I'd suggest the Stoeger Condor Outback in 20 Gauge with walnut furniture and blued metal finish. MSRP $449

It's simple to operate, the recoil is moderate and its appearance is benign (to suit the NYC PC environment).

With a two shot break open design you'll have no problem meeting the restrictive regulations in NYC.

The Condor can be broken down for transport in a nondescript case to avoid the curiosity of neighbors.

Add a lace on butt-cuff to carry a half dozen rounds of your favorite flavor of ammunition and you've got a neat little HD weapon.

 

[George]

The Condor is a great idea for home defense, I probably never would have thought of it. My grandfather for years had a side by side 12 ga for defense in his apt. The way most of us think, usually cruise right over this type of shotgun when browsing, but their is absolutly nothing wrong with it for home defense.

Pump Action Shotgun - Model 870 Express Synthetic 18inch - Remington Shotguns
This could be another option for you as well, basic 870 with 4 + 1 capacity and cyl bore barrel. I dont know NYC restrictions but I cant imagine they would have a problem with this.

George

 

[superoilhunter]

thanks a lot guys.. I have been reading up. So much to learnnnn!

 

[NYCShooter]

Any pump shotgun is legal, provided the magazine does not hold more then 5 rounds; pistol grips (but not collapsible stocks) are legal. Semi-auto shotguns are also legal, with the same 5-round imitation. In addition, a semi-auto must have a standard stock (pistol grips or collapsible stocks are not permitted).

Stay away from a SxS for HD, especially a Stoeger. All else being equal, why limit yourself to two rounds (even in NYC), when you could have a 5+1 available? At zero-dark-thirty, under stress, you don't want to have to break open a SxS to reload after two rounds. The Stoeger guns are even more problematic, since they lack extractors/ejectors.

I live in NYC and own an 870 with a Blackhawk SpecOps adjustable, recoil reducing, pistol grip stock, and a Benelli M4 with a standard (non-pistol grip) stock. My ammo of choice had been Federal LE132 00 (00 buck, 9-pellets, FliteControl wad, lower velocity), but is now the new LE132 1B (#1 buck, 15-pellets, FliteControl wad, lower velocity).

 

[MDX]

If you need more then two rounds with a shotgun for a home defene scenario in NYC more ammo may not solve your problem. If the noise doesnt paralize everyone in the dwelling or you miss completly you may have too large of shot. 00 may penetrate walls and kill your neighbor depending on your dwelling. how about a non lethal shotgun round first, then birdshot then a slug. That douchbag will have alot of time on there hands to repent as they pick the birdshot out of his a$$.

NYC police response time is excellent compared to some of the more suburb/rural parts of NY. You are trying to protect/defend your family not renact a scene from the movie HEAT. Patrol will be there in 2 mins and then ESU within 5-10 if not faster.

Picking a shotgun is the easy part. Ammo choices will vary so much for NYC residents. Some live in regular two story residentals and some are in apartments in high rise bldgs. You need choose an ammo that will not penetrate walls but not also cause a crazy richochet in concrete/steel bldgs.

 

[NYCShooter]

If you need more then two rounds with a shotgun for a home defene scenario in NYC more ammo may not solve your problem. If the noise doesnt paralize everyone in the dwelling or you miss completly you may have too large of shot. 00 may penetrate walls and kill your neighbor depending on your dwelling. how about a non lethal shotgun round first, then birdshot then a slug. That douchbag will have alot of time on there hands to repent as they pick the birdshot out of his a$$.

NYC police response time is excellent compared to some of the more suburb/rural parts of NY. You are trying to protect/defend your family not renact a scene from the movie HEAT. Patrol will be there in 2 mins and then ESU within 5-10 if not faster.

Picking a shotgun is the easy part. Ammo choices will vary so much for NYC residents. Some live in regular two story residentals and some are in apartments in high rise bldgs. You need choose an ammo that will not penetrate walls but not also cause a crazy richochet in concrete/steel bldgs.

All else being equal, I would rather have one in the chamber and five in the magazine, rather than two in a SxS. The SxS offers no advantage at all (and a couple of big disadvantages).

In addition, in a home invasion, I am not the least bit worried about "noise", just stopping the intruder. Birdshot won't cut it in ANY HD scenario; it is for the birds, only. And, any load that is capable of stopping an intruder (enough to penetrate to the vital organs), will penetrate walls to a greater or lesser extent (depending on the specific load). FYI, I would not count on the police to arrive in time to save your a_s, as most such social encounters are over in less than a minute. You will need to take care of business on your own. IMO, the ideal HD laod is LE132 1B (low velocity, low recoil, 15-pellet, FliteControl).

 

[MDX]

Birdshot vs. Buckshot for home defense. | Field & Stream

There is alot of good debate there on birdshot vs buck for home defense. Birdhsot at close range will get the job done. The job doesnt have to be lethal, especially with weak castle doctrine laws and zero stand your ground laws to protect you.

I know, I know its better to be judged by twelve then carried by six but understanding the laws is important to understanding use of lethal force.

In NYS especially NYC you have very little if any rights to defend yourself. if you shoot someone with a lethal load and do not confirm they have a weapon, you will be buying stock in soap on a rope. I am not saying I agree with it, but its how it is here. Just things to keep in mind.

A mans home is his castle, you invade another mans castle and you deserve what you get, lol.

Ultimate Home Defense load: Fed LE132-1B - Maryland Shooters has alot of good info and reviews about the ammo you mentioned. definetly worth checking out.

 

[Noodles]

Shooting someone with birdshot is going to get you in just as much trouble as shooting someone with buckshot, but you'll likely also be stuck with a civil suit for any number of wrongdoings.

 

[MDX]

your probably right, but they cannot paint you as some cold blooded mofo who is planning for war. Getting in "trouble" is better then murder

 

[Figment]

There's nothing wrong with a double barrel as kmussack suggested. 2 shots is likely to be enough to deter a home invader (they don't know you don't have more). However, consider a pump with 4 in the mag, as a good option. Get a shot saddle as suggested for quicker reloads.

A pump has 2 advantages. 1, you can rack the slide and yell at the intruder (if you prefer this method, some don't). The sound of a pump racking alone is intimidating, and they'll realize you mean business. If your lucky they'll run and you'll not have to use it. The second, is it's a bit safer if you are of the mind to leave 4 loaded, and none in the chamber. There is nothing to fire if someone touches the gun, until the slide is racked. I know many here will say that's not proper home defense, and for their situations they may be right. But, depending on who lives with you, and what they know about guns, it might be a safer option for you.

For NYC keep it under 5 rounds total. A standard 4 in the mag and 1 in the chamber semi auto or pump is a good choice. Don't get a pistol grip or a folder. Honestly it's harder to aim them anyways if your a newbie, and it's not good home defense to break your nose firing a pistol grip shotty at an intruder. Just get a reasonabley short barrel (20" or under) with a regular stock and you've got a fine SD weapon.

There are many threads you can search here on shot choice. I care not to comment on that as it's a matter of preference, living conditions, and best choice for the saftey of your family and neighbors. Search around the site and you'll learn enough to make the right choice.

 

[Noodles]

your probably right, but they cannot paint you as some cold blooded mofo who is planning for war. Getting in "trouble" is better then murder

Murder is killing someone both unlawfully and premeditated. There's no way you could have premeditated that, and the court would have to prove that shooting an intruder in self-defense was unlawful.

 

[Figment]

Regarding the bird vs buckshot debate...I learned a lot from hickock45s videos on it, demonstrating birdshot at close range. If your shooting 5 yards or less in a house there is little difference. Bird shot will do some serious damage like a slug or buckshot. If your shooting across a 40ft room, it'll spread out more for sure and might not take down a crack head.

You have to think about what your likely shooting lanes would be in a HD situation and choose from there. In my house I figure I'd be upstairs, in my bedroom doorway covering the halls. One hall is about 25 ft, and the other is 15 ft. My kids rooms are off to the sides, so I'm not concerned about overpenetration, and buckshot would work ok for me. I'm not likely to shoot through my walls and take out a neighbor while he/she sleeps.

 

[NYCShooter]

Sorry, but there is no valid reason, in any possible scenario, to choose birdshot for HD (unless, that is, your home is invaded by a flock of angry ducks, or a family member is being assaulted by a deranged Blue Jay). The damage that birdshot will do is not at all close to being equal to the damage that 00 or 1B buck will do, at ANY distance. Recommending BS for HD is bad advice; using birdshot for HD could get you killed.

As for LE132 1B, the thread that was referenced on Maryland Shooters was pre-introduction. Since LE132 1B became available, a few months ago, there have been many threads attesting to its superiority for HD. Here is a recent one (which includes a review from the Box O'Truth): Shotgunworld.com • View topic - Product Evaluation - Federal #1 Buckshot
I have been using it for about two months.

And, here is a brief from the Tactical Firearms Institute regarding Shotgun Home Defense Ammunition: Shotgun Home Defense Ammunition, .357 SIG -- A Solution in Search of a Problem?

 

[Figment]

The damage that birdshot will do is not at all close to being equal to the damage that 00 or 1B buck will do, at ANY distance.

Shotgun Myth - YouTube

I disagree with your point that it'll get you killed "at ANY distance" based on video I've watched. However, personally I'd not choose birdshot for HD unless I was really worried about penetration through walls hitting loved ones.