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While Army Sgt. Matthew Corrigan was sound asleep inside his Northwest D.C. home, the Metropolitan Police Department (MPD) was preparing to launch a full-scale invasion of his home. SWAT and explosive ordnance disposal (EOD) teams spent four hours readying the assault on the English basement apartment in the middle of the snowstorm of the century.The police arrested the veteran of the Iraq war and searched his house without a warrant, not to protect the public from a terrorist or stop a crime in progress, but to rouse a sleeping man the police thought might have an unregistered gun in his home.

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Some much for the Land of the Free and the home of the Brave.
 

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I loved how he kept his cool "Guess I'm gonna have to buy a new door". I hope that I'm that respectful and collected WHEN they violate my rights and break the law for me on a 'suspicion'.

I did like his neighbors line “Here was Matt, who spent a year fighting for our country in Iraq -- where these police would never set foot in -- and they treat him like trash off the street.” I hope my neighbors would say the same sane thing.
 

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I am surprised the MPD or any PD would do this w/o a warrant.
There is only one possible action that is what they did, to file a law suit and seek charges on both the people behind ordering
and executing those type of actions.

Fundamental Liberties


The Equal Justice Foundation works to insure that:
• Citizens shall not be torn from their homes and children in the middle of the night based on nothing more than hearsay.
• Men and women shall not be presumed guilty until they can prove their innocence.
• A secret tribunal shall not have the power to force a man from his home without notice or hearing.
• Police shall not have the right to enter and search a citizen's home without a warrant.
• Citizens shall not be imprisoned based only on hearsay.
• Citizens are not more afraid of the police than they are of criminals.
• A legal system exists that does not tolerate perjury or the subornation of perjury.
• Citizens shall not be censured by public officials for crimes they have not committed.
• Men and women are not made to work as indentured servants or held in thrall to others for acts they have not committed.
• A marriage license does not make men and women servants of the State or give courts possession of their children.
 

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One of these days they are going to piss off the wrong vet!
 

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They already have pissed off several that they shouldn't.
Just a matter of time before they actually meet up in a foyer, halllway, yard, woods, whatever as a lot guys are starting to think more proactively than reactively.

Going to be a lot sad significant others and kids when swatuberteam6 comes across one of those persons/groups and find out the hard way that thier clearing techniques got nuthin on an experienced combat solider's defensive and clearing techniques.

It not a 'remote possibility', its a 'definite eventuality'

The only reason some of these guys haven't gone off is due to lack of specific opposition/clear cut enemy.
They simply don't know who they should be fighting, so they sit, wait, and prepare for the enemy to show themselves by coming to them.


Of course the news will play it like the vet(s) are insane or part of a militia or some other such tripe and the heroic cops were just doing thier job by serving papers in a peaceful and respectful manner when the vet lost it and became seriously agressive.
But we'll only ever get one side of that story, what with all the 'crminals' conveniently dying in place because they wouldn't surrender
 

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I do not think it is bad faith lets get this guy or anything but more along the lines of the brainwashing and play along type of policies that are more appropriate of the Gestapo type of police. Basically total ignorance about the US constitution.
I think they did not think about the seriousness of these actions. They might be now realizing the amount of schit is coming at everyone involved.
 

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They already have pissed off several that they shouldn't.
Just a matter of time before they actually meet up in a foyer, halllway, yard, woods, whatever as a lot guys are starting to think more proactively than reactively.

Going to be a lot sad significant others and kids when swatuberteam6 comes across one of those persons/groups and find out the hard way that thier clearing techniques got nuthin on an experienced combat solider's defensive and clearing techniques.

It not a 'remote possibility', its a 'definite eventuality'

The only reason some of these guys haven't gone off is due to lack of specific opposition/clear cut enemy.
They simply don't know who they should be fighting, so they sit, wait, and prepare for the enemy to show themselves by coming to them.

Of course the news will play it like the vet(s) are insane or part of a militia or some other such tripe and the heroic cops were just doing thier job by serving papers in a peaceful and respectful manner when the vet lost it and became seriously agressive.
But we'll only ever get one side of that story, what with all the 'crminals' conveniently dying in place because they wouldn't surrender
LIKE! LIKE! LIKE! LIKE! LIKE! EVERYTHING in this statement rings PURE TRUTH!
Really like the swatuberteam6...gonna use that!
 

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The police messed up but not as much as you guys are making it out to be. He called the VA crisis hotline and admited to having firearms. Yes the VA operator messed up but when he hung up I am sure it was policy for the operator to call the police. So now the police get a call saying that he is suicidal, had firearms (which I am sure they looked up to see if they were registered which they werent) and most likely PTSD. Since he is a veteran they errored on the side of caution with tons of guys. They needed to make sure he was ok because of what the VA operator probably told them. They also most likely knew that he had illegal firearms since he had admitted it to the operator (could be enough probable cause for a search) So I think the actions they took for the most part would of been justified if they had taken there time and followed procedure. No need to break down someones door when its locked and they are outside with no reason to believe anyone else is in there.
I do feel for the guy though, that is a crazy night to have to go through.
 

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It was more than a crazy night! I think he was in jail for a couple of weeks.
 

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The police messed up but not as much as you guys are making it out to be. He called the VA crisis hotline and admited to having firearms. Yes the VA operator messed up but when he hung up I am sure it was policy for the operator to call the police. So now the police get a call saying that he is suicidal, had firearms (which I am sure they looked up to see if they were registered which they werent) and most likely PTSD. Since he is a veteran they errored on the side of caution with tons of guys. They needed to make sure he was ok because of what the VA operator probably told them. They also most likely knew that he had illegal firearms since he had admitted it to the operator (could be enough probable cause for a search) So I think the actions they took for the most part would of been justified if they had taken there time and followed procedure. No need to break down someones door when its locked and they are outside with no reason to believe anyone else is in there.
I do feel for the guy though, that is a crazy night to have to go through.
Yes but they destroyed his place! Ruined his property and took his stuff. In the article it says they cut open luggage instead of unzipping it. Still you do not go in balls to the wall when someone is reaching out for help. Be prepared is fine but they treated him like a criminal not as someone seeking help. Standard procedure my ass!!
 

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So I think the actions they took for the most part would of been justified if they had taken there time and followed procedure.
So acting like total F'heads is OK as long as its in response to hearsay?

Wow, they must be doing it wrong around here then.
When a call like that comes into the system around these parts they send 2 officers to do a 'check the welfare' knock on the door while other patrols may moving in that direction, but not racing to get there. Just sort of positioning to be available if needed. SWAT doesn't even come into it.

If its out of town the nearest road deputy or state boy pops by for a 'check the welfare'. If there's two in the area, they'll send both, but for the most part its just one officer.

And we have a LOT of vets and a LOT of guns here, both registered and unregistered.
They get treated with the same response as any other person in that situation.

When it comes to 'shots fired' its a totally different reaction of course, but the mere presence of a firearm doesn'rt cause anyone to piss thier pants and roll out the heavy armor

Check the VA policy and I think you'll find that narcing someone out is more personal whim than it is policy.
At least in all the privacy statements I've seen or delt with through them over the years.
Actually the only way a LE agency can obtain or know about any of your VA records, including mental state and home address, is if they (...wait for it...) obtain a warrant beforehand.

The hotline operator should be out on her ass and facing repercussions IMO.

All she has done is cause even greater uncertainty of the usefulness and validity of a helpline.
Some folks will not call now even if theydesperately need help simply because they don't trust the system now.
I mean seriously, who the hell wants to make a call for help knowing it could end up resulting in radically more stress piled upon an already deeply stressed psyche?

Might as well just call local LE agency or 911 directly and tell them you have a gun and plan to use it if that's all thats going to happen when trying to reach out for some assistance or mearly someone with a bit of sympathy to talk to that presumably has at least a modicum of understanding about what a caller may be going through.

The whole chain of events is disgusting and making excuses for the operator circumventing policy or LE agency overreaction and skipping then abusing individual rights based on hearsay about 'immediate need' doesn't make it any more pallatable.
 

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Wow that second page makes a big difference.
Still I think if they had waited for the search warrant this story would be completely different. As far as not reading him his rights if you notice they didn't really arrest him initially (debatable I admit). They allowed him to check into the hospital instead of being forced into the hospital. They didnt arrest him until after he was released and then for the "illegal" firearms. There are a lot of details left out as well in this story. It says he was forgotten about in jail for 2 weeks. Did he see a judge during this time because it didnt say either way. When was he allowed a lawyer? I agree the way the searched was unnecessary and not waiting for a warrant and not making it clear they went in for some (even most likely a made up one) immediate safety concern. For example, traps, (they did say odor of gas though) another person, ect.
But even though they destroyed his stuff I am curious to know your opinions on our border. If a dog "hits" on your car and they tear apart your car when nothing is there they dont put it back together for you. So is that right? Why can they do that?

Lastly what I find most interesting are the comments here about one day a military member being raided illegally and him fighting back. As far as I am concerned if someone breaks in my home and I see a firearm then its ok to start shooting. If police come in without identifieing themselves then I think is justifiable self defense as long as its not obvious who they are (lights are on and you can see them plain as day). But I am curious though how peoples reactions to something like that would be when/if it happens somewhere. I have a feeling most people on this site will say the guy fighting back was wrong and he should of done this and known that.
 

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Tifosi,
I dont remember reading anything about a warrant being needed by VA policy. I just went a couple months ago to be apart of some brain function medical study and the paperwork I signed and was told about verbally said my information can only be shared if I am a threat to myself or others.

Oh I want trying to justify the actions they took just illustrate how it got out of hand. Its kind of like the phone game. What was said changes as its passed on.

Also keep in mind this happened in D.C. where over response is a give in. When I was standing post in D.C. I saw about 60 cops cars down the street for an hour or so in S.E. D.C. and when they left the street was empty which was unusual. I saw a guy getting beat and head being stomped into the road when a cop was standing right there alone and they didn't do much, granted there were like 6 guys beating up the guy on the ground. We had 8 guys show up when I called them because someone was trying to light our brick building on fire lol. So in D.C. atleast it appears that the longer the event unfolds the more police you get.
I agree that many police didn't need to respond in this case, I agree they overreacted,
But yes if they had taken their time and followed procedure they would of been justisfied because they would of gotten a warrant and not destroyed all of his stuff.
 

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I stand corrected:
Apparently the crisis line allows for operators to contact emergency services.
From the actual crisis hotline website FAQ
If I do share personal information when I contact the Veterans Crisis Line, will it be kept confidential?
Yes. Information you provide will not be shared unless you give a responder permission to share it or indicate that you would like to receive care after the call, chat, or text session. However, if you are in imminent danger or at risk of harming others, a rescue will be coordinated with local officials.


That is literally the first time I've seen anything that says a VA office/person can contact anyone without the consent of the patient.
There's policies out there that don't even allow your VA doctor to see some of your information should you not want to share it.
(look at the myhealthyvet slef entered data pricacy policy for example)

Now if dude actually gave his name and address then I suppose that would indeed fall under 'permission to share', but if not, she ****ed him and needs a punch in the head after a kick in the ovaries.
The line (supposedly) allows for total anominity, (see FAQ), and if even something as goofy as a caller ID was used to pinpoint him without his knowledge or consent then it was wrong, wrong, wrong.

Doesn't change how I feel about the situation though.
Depending on who she called (911, police, emergency rescue? dunno) the LE agency may not have even been supposed to be there, let alone having a 'send in the assault team' reaction.

The whole thing stinks.
As for some foolish notion of 'probable cause' allowing for stupidity, perhaps we need more random calls to tell on people based on 3rd hand information to prove the futility.
I know a guy who has an either perpetually angry or completely depressed goth freind who has a rope that he keeps tied in a scary noose,
AND he doesn't have any black freinds. Better shred his life too.
You know, just in case.

People who call hotlines are generally aware that they need help/conversation/caring person to talk to.
That's why they called to begin with: to seek help or be talked down so they didn't just go over the edge
Logic and statistics lean heavily toward the dictate that if someone does indeed call a hotline the odds of them actually completing the act are much, much slimmer than if they contact no~one and just sit around and stew.

They want to know that someone honestly cares, not to have the dogs set loose on them for seeking help.
If such things or simular happen to enough persons who call, then no~one is going to call anymore out of total lack of faith.

As to the 'smell of gas', the neighbor did say that the whole apartment was seviced by electricity. They simply chose to ignore the information.
Once the fire dept shut off the gas supply to the building it would become a non~issue anyway.

The border?
The only time you'll get me near one is if they suddenly decide to allow civlians to camp out nearby and pay them to shoot illegals crossing over between designated points relevant to density of occupied campsites.
A dog may very well hit on my car (depending on which I'm using) as the PO was a rope burnin SOB and I'm still finding seeds and tiny bits of roaches under carpet and whatnot even after several years.
IOW I wouldn't be stupid enough to even get near a border with it, let alone try to pass through securirty.

That doesn't make it any less BS for them to tear apart a POV and not put it back together or help to do it or even pay for a mechanic to do so if they find nothing.
It happens, when not actually warranted, usually as a form of punishment for anything from a smirk to wearing the wrong baseball team's jersey, because they know they can claim suspicion of smuggling and they know they don't have to put it back together. They don't even have to tear it apart properly. Vicegrips and hammers are adiquiate AFA they are concerned. Saving the paint isn't even a consideration..
I know a couple people who have had it done to them simply for looking suspicious or not showing proper subservience to the 'authority figure'.
(like when an un~named relative in a LE agency would break a taillight, then issue a ticket for a broken taillight simply because someone agitated him somehow)
Fortunately those *******s are long gone from the local station and they've been replaced with actual polite, curtious and respectable officers.
Or so I'm told as I still won't go near there. I've no use for Canada, nor did I have use for Mexico when I lived near there.

Moot point, dude was subjected to local law enforcement agencies, not border agents who have a radically different MO because thier job and work enviornment is completely different. You go to them, they don't come you.
Warrantless searches are expected at a border, as you imply consent mearly by showing up.
You know, like going anywhere near a TSA agent at an airport, except border officers are better trained, sworn, and have guns.
 

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Let me start off off topic then get back on topic. As an American citizen we have rights guaranteed by the consitution. If I go to Canada and when I come back they destroy my car then they just took away my working vehicle (my property) without due process did they not? That violates the constitution. Ok so we will say that going to border is implied consent to the search. Well we have a right to take away that consent at anytime we wish. So taking apart someones car and not reassembling it and damaging it in the process even with probable cause is wrong. I dont care if its a border or not. As an American citizen we have rights. Also as an american then cant just not allow you to come back into the states for refusing a search (not saying they wont deny you but just that they shouldnt be able too).
Not trying to pick on you but trying to point this out as a whole on this forum. Did you notice how you basically said those policies on the border dont effect you since you dont go there? I am assuming you are a veteran and as such you should know the military isnt about "me, I" its about "we, us". I dont understand how people can say "well I wouldnt of done that" or "he was stupid for doing that" or "why didnt he allow whatever to happen". If We the people continue to only care about injustices that we can see ourselves become victim too then we aren't doing our part and nothing will change because we the people will always be divided.

Now back on topic.
I agree that people will be less likely to get help if its going to come back to bite them. The operator on the line is the main person at blame because she assumed things the caller never said and then called the police. The police probably were bored or acting on alterior motives and chose to make this a bigger issue then it needed to be. Either way his rights were violated, the constitution violated, and laws broken. I just wish people would give a hoot about every instance of this on not just when they can relate.
 

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Not trying to pick on you but trying to point this out as a whole on this forum. Did you notice how you basically said those policies on the border dont effect you since you dont go there?
Excellent point.
Falls in with the 'I'm a single shot bolt gun hunter who is not effected by EBR laws or policies', which indeed is wrong and fails miserably when a united front is needed, not partisan devisivness.

It honestly never even crossed my mind when writing it, but you're absolutety right.
 

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Exactly. Just imagine for a moment if regardless of personal opinion everyone stood up for what was right and wrong (according to the constitution and the laws that are comliant with the constitution) on everything if it didnt effect them. All the B.S. laws that everyone hates that overstep their authority would be gone in no time flat. Instead everyone takes on the "it doesnt effect me so its not my problem" mentality and nothing gets done. We have all seen what this approach gets us and thats small victories here and there but its a losing battle.
 
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