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Discussion Starter #1
This is part review, part request for advice...

So, I recently picked this up. Bought it slightly used. Everything I've shot up to this point is a single action. Started shooting this, with 2 boxes of ammo (100 rounds). Of the 2 boxes only about 40 shots hit the target at ~25 yards. With my S&W M&P9c (my normal carry gun) I can hit an 8.5" target 45 out of 50 times at 50 yards. I've been carrying the 9mm for about 3 years now, so I've got lots more practice with it.
Once I got more used to the USP, and realized I couldn't squeeze that slow, I got better, but everything was still hitting low. I started aiming about 6" high on the target, and I started hitting better, but still not great. With every pull, I seem to flinch a LOT. I don't think I flinch this much with my M&P
The trigger on the USP seems to pull forever. It gets heavier as it comes back, till it feels like I'm pulling a car with my finger.

How much of this is likely to be the switch to DAO? How much of this should I be blaming on the pistol (seriously)? What's the best way to help correct? Should I just sell the USP and put the money toward something new?
 

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If you like the gun and want to improve the trigger a factory LEM trigger is the best way to go. You can find the parts on HKPARTS.NET. If you think you can handle the instal yourself their is a good write up on HKPRO.COM. If not have a local gunsmith change it out. It is not that difficult, I have done both my HK pistols. USPC and HK45. If you do not have a gunsmith you trust you can send your frame to Bill Springfield, he does good work, just tell him not to modify your mainspring.

The LEM trigger is usually around 4 - 5 lbs pull weight. (mine are 4) A lot of take up that is less than 1 lbs pull necessary to bring the hammer to the back of its travel. Reset is short and crisp.
 

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DAO is hard to get use to for some. Sounds like starting at 25yds is a mistake, start at 7yds then 15yds. Spend time at these closer ranges getting use to the trigger then move back to 25yds.

M1-TA
 

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Are you really talking about dao only ? It is bit confusing because some refer to lem as dao.
Can you tell me which ver. It is exactly ?

Either way tho, if the trigger is that heavy it's not good. You probably need lighten it with a trigger job or going to another version. I personally recommend light lem.
 

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Yeah, USPs can be true DAO or LEM (or DA/SA of course). DAO is pretty rare, LEM is more common. If you got it used, who knows what springs it has in it; I got a used USPc once that had all non-spec springs in it because the guy before me thought he knew more than HK.

I second the recommendation for an LEM conversion. If you want DAO, there's really no reason not to go with LEM. You get the safety and consistency benefits of DAO with the ease of shooting well of a single action gun.

I wouldn't sell the gun, at least not yet. I'd be happy to meet you at GCL some time (if that's where you shoot), and offer you a second opinion.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
It is an honest to goodness DAO. The seller sold it as DAO, and it acts like DAO. I had someone at Ontario Rod and Gun (my "home" range) confirm that its DAO. I'll have to check into LEM. I have to admit being totally ignorant of this (not for long, Google is searching in another tab as I type here).

I assume it's possible to switch the DAO to an LEM? I know with some Sigs you can switch between DA/SA, SAO, and DAO, but I thought I read somewhere that USPs aren't that modifiable.
I'll know more after a little Google work. I'm happy to hear this. I like the way the gun feels, and I like the idea of an upgrade to 40 caliber from my 9mm.

Thanks for the advice so far!
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Ok, not to sound like a fool for saying I was sure, but...
After doing some research, and checking with what I found on the web, it does actually seem to be an LEM. Now I'm not 100% sure it is, because I've already claimed to be sure once, and I'm not about to repeat that mistake again.
On the other hand, I read that there's a lighter version and a heavier version of the LEM trigger. Maybe switching to the lighter LEM trigger might help. It also looks like it may be possible to switch to SA/DA, but that it would be pricey. It appears I have more options than I expected.
 

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"The trigger on the USP seems to pull forever. It gets heavier as it comes back, till it feels like I'm pulling a car with my finger."

This does not sound like a LEM trigger. Heavy or light. The LEM breaks more like a SA trigger. Their is a light pull to bring the hammer back (which is already cocked internally) then a 4 - 5 lbs break.

If it is the factory installed trigger, you should be able to call HK with the serial number and find out what trigger it is.

Going to a DA/SA may not make you to happy either. The DA pull is around 10 - 12 lbs. HK is not known for their triggers.

You will be able to instal a DA/SA or LEM in your gun, just need to buy the parts.

You may want to browse around on HKPRO.com, a lot of good information there.


George
 

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LEM is demonstrated here: LEM Description - YouTube

You should have an extremely light pull up to a point and then about 4, 6, or 8 pounds at the end depending on the variant. Then a short reset (compared to a true DAO which has to go all the way back).

If you are considering the conversion, you're welcome to shoot my LEM. I also have an HK SA/DA, so you could try both and see what you prefer. USPs are extremely modifiable, you can convert to any variant you want.
 

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"The trigger on the USP seems to pull forever. It gets heavier as it comes back, till it feels like I'm pulling a car with my finger." ~~~This does not sound like a LEM trigger. Heavy or light.~~~~~ You will be able to instal a DA/SA or LEM in your gun, just need to buy the parts.~~George
I agree. It's probably not LEM. Here is a easy way to tell. WITH AN EMPTY GUN THAT HAS BEEN SAFETY CHECKED TWICE WITHOUT ANY AMMO IN THE ROOM, Rack the slide and then try to pull back the hammer with your finger. If you can do it easily then it's LEM of some sort. If you have a spur on the hammer OR if you need to really put some effort in to doing it then you have some thing else.

I also vote for conversion to LEM. see :
LEM installation instructions

Buy parts :
HK | LEM Kit - HKPARTS.NET OR
HK LEM Trigger Conversion Kit - All USP and All HK45 - Top Gun Supply

The conversion, while confusing, is not that hard. If you chose to do so, you may opt to retain the Trigger Rebound Spring and not take the trigger off the frame. The installation of the trigger along with the TRS is only real PITA part of the conversion process. I'd be happy to help or do it for you. (but I'm in Rockland) It sounds like Scotchman and George is also knowledgeable, so sounds like you got enough people to help tho.

Do note that part of the USP's beauty is the flexibility of the ignition system. You can go to DA/SA , DAO, LEM, light LEM, match, and few other hybrid versions relatively easily. It's part of the fun and I recommend that you enjoy the process rather than getting frustrated with it. I might add that IMHO HK's are a good firearm, so it's worth spending time on.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
From the sound of it, it seems like it's worth holding on to and trying at least one other solution. The video listed above was the video I watched to educate myself yesterday. What's odd is that when I rack it (empty of course), the hammer seems to stay half cocked (more like 1/3 to 1/4 cocked). I can also short-stroke it if I rack it, pull the trigger, hold the trigger back, rack it again.

I'll wait till my next paycheck and order a light LEM conversion kit. I'll see if I can get it in myself (I built my AR15, so I'm a little comfortable being an amateur gunsmith), if I can't, expect to hear from me some more here. I didn't pay so much for it, that I can't afford to buy some parts.
 

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If you built an AR lower, then you should be good to go. I think you'll be happy with a light LEM.

Be warned though, LEM is different. So, keep an open mind and be prepared to spend some time to get used to it. You may want to take up that offer to let you shoot some one's LEM ( some where up in the thread), just to make sure that you don't absolutely hate it. Also, you may end up playing with different springs to get it to do exactly what you want. For me, I ended up with set of springs that puts me some where between heavy LEM and Light LEM after a while; and It took a bit of soul searching to get to that.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
LEM is demonstrated here: LEM Description - YouTube

You should have an extremely light pull up to a point and then about 4, 6, or 8 pounds at the end depending on the variant. Then a short reset (compared to a true DAO which has to go all the way back).

If you are considering the conversion, you're welcome to shoot my LEM. I also have an HK SA/DA, so you could try both and see what you prefer. USPs are extremely modifiable, you can convert to any variant you want.
Where do you shoot? I wouldn't mind taking you up on that offer. Alternatively, I could have you as a guest out at Ontario Rod and Gun.
 
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