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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Has there ever been a law suit challenging the constitutionality and/or privacy issues involved with mandatory references needed to gain a handgun permit? It seems wrong (and silly) to me that grown adults need references in order to practice a right granted by their creators... How does that make any sense? A federal background check is not enough??? If the 2nd amendment is a "right", are we not allowed to practice that right with privacy???

Is the 2nd amendment the only "right" that is legally so drastically different depending on which town/county you're standing in within this Country??? Long waiting periods, crazy high fees, while the hypocrite politicians pulling for even more gun laws walk around with armed security detail every day that we pay for.

Are we subjects or citizens? Why do NY'ers constantly fall for having their rights trampled on?
 

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Preaching to the choir. Lots of stuff about the BS has been challenged. Surprisingly (not), nothing has happened. As for references specifically, I don't know.
 

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Welcome to the site and the never ending questions on stupid laws created by NYS.
 

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Not that I like it, but there are at least 7 other states in the union that ask for references on the PP. I don't think that they are called, but they are still asked for. Just another stupid request. Imagine if we needed references for the priviledge of driving a car.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
These laws are so wrong... I'm ok with a federal background check, anything more than that is simply the gov't screwing with us.

Wow, having to list an add in the paper for a permit... That's out of control... Sorry to hear that's law in DE. I can't believe that would stand in court.
 

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it could be worse I could be in jersey.

I too am ok with a federal check. That is my idea of common sense gun control.

As liberal as Delaware has gotten I worry about how crazy our laws could get. Compared to states around us ( except PA) our gun laws are decent. A majority of the people who apply get a permit but they do have the may issue clause. It used to be pretty hard but not as much now. We also can open carry, have no mag restrictions and can sell any gun to another delaware res privatley as long as they are a resident of the state. Most of us responsible gun owners make sure the person has a permit to show they are ok and have them sign a bill of sale. We cant have silencers or full auto though.

I have heard it is almost impossible to get a permit in jersey.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Yeah it could be worse, NJ, IL, DC, Cuba, China or nazi germany... But I'm scared that is where we're headed and it isn't too far ahead. In the end people deserve the gov't they vote for. It's sad for freedom loving Americans who are trapped in these areas that are really non-freedom zones. I know it isn't ea$y, but law suits should be continuously FLOODING the courts in those jurisdictions.
 

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Yeah it could be worse, NJ, IL, DC, Cuba, China or nazi germany... But I'm scared that is where we're headed and it isn't too far ahead. In the end people deserve the gov't they vote for. It's sad for freedom loving Americans who are trapped in these areas that are really non-freedom zones. I know it isn't ea$y, but law suits should be continuously FLOODING the courts in those jurisdictions.
Very true. I think if a judge in jersey who denied a permit for no good reason were to get sued if someone was murdered then maybe they would think twice, but that wont happen. I do think the judge should be liable though. Hell liberals should be liable for what many of their constituents baby daddys, sons and grand sons do.

Delaware just passed laws allowing them to vote again after they get out of jail. They used to have to wait five years and they can get foods stamps now ( obamabucks) they used to not be able to if they were felons. Basically we are feeding the people that will commit crimes against us one day.
 

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I think that asking for references is perfectly acceptable. I just don't think there should be so much bull**** after you get your permit. Make the application process thorough enough, and you eliminate the need for senseless rules that only affect law abiding citizens in the first place.
 

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I think that asking for references is perfectly acceptable. I just don't think there should be so much bull**** after you get your permit. Make the application process thorough enough, and you eliminate the need for senseless rules that only affect law abiding citizens in the first place.
Like the application process. "Pistol permits" are about the most useless laws we have in this state.
 

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ideally it would be nice if law biding ciitzens did not have to ask for what is a right like carrying a gun to protect yourself.

I can almost support the idea of permits, but I dont like the hoopla. I think a background check, small fee and finger printing should suffice.
 

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Five references in Delaware? Isn't that like 25% of the state? Just kidding. I don't know what premise you could advance such a lawsuit accept under a general rights argument. It obvious and intuitive that one rights don't rest on the fair opinions of others, but how do advance this argument in a court today?
 

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I have made several comments on this forum about the inability of the antis to understand or use logic or common sense.
Everyone with an ounce of brains knows that references are totally useless. What possible info could be provided by a reference that an FBI and a NYSP background check could not provide? And if that reference were able to know any such info, do they think that the applicant would use that reference? How silly! But, in a way this silliness and stupidity on the part of the antis is good for us because every instance of this inane anti mentality serves to strengthen our cause and encourages us to keep up the struggle to make these morons understand that the exercise of our rights does not need a REFERENCE in order to be valid. How silly!!!!!
 

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ideally it would be nice if law biding ciitzens did not have to ask for what is a right like carrying a gun to protect yourself.

I can almost support the idea of permits, but I dont like the hoopla. I think a background check, small fee and finger printing should suffice.
Why do you get fingerprinted to do everything nowadays? You are not a criminal! You should not be treated as such. No fee, no permit, no BG check and you'd have the same amount of crime. See: The majority of states that have never HEARD of a pistol permit and I have to explain what it is to residents.
 

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Fingerprints, references, employment information, disclosing medical records, the involvement of judges and police. It's all BS to discourage people from going through the process. A background check to buy and maybe a course that covers defensive use and relevant state laws on the use of deadly force for people who want to carry should be more than enough to satisfy the anti-gun whiners. There is no process that can prevent all dangerous people from legally obtaining guns without banning them completely (see Jiverly Wong), which is not going to happen and certainly wouldn't completely prevent anybody from obtaining one illegally. Exercising a right shouldn't be a burdensome process that is more difficult to complete and subject to more bureaucratic whims than a license to drive.
 
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