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ive spent the last few days looking for credible information on this online... however it seems that both sides of the argument have quite a bit of propaganda in them.... i even read that some of the groups that are the biggest anti fracking are covertly funded by opec !

if they can use non toxic chemicals and find a way to avoid the water table then i say go for it. but it better damn well lower prices / start an energy revolution.....
 

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I'm pretty up to speed on it.

The paranoia is all overreaction from uneducated people. There are risks, as there are with anything of that sort, but when done properly there isn't much bad about it. The only way the water table is affected is if they don't sleeve the well properly which would be human error like not letting the casing cement cure enough. Completely avoidable. The thought that the fracking will connect the methane in the gas bearing shale to the aquifer is insane. The shale is 5,000 feet deep (minimum, they drill it down to 25,000 feet or something and it isn't worth drilling until it's at least 3,000 feet deep) and the aquifers are generally less than 150 feet deep. Fracking charges are on par with a shotgun shell. They aren't going to cause an induced fault that spans 2,700 feet or more of earth and contaminate the aquifer with deep methane.

All of the fluid is reclaimed and treated at a water treatment plant which makes money for the plant at times when they have extra capacity. The water they take from local streams is negligible.

They say that the companies won't tell you what's in their fracking fluid. Not true. They tell you exactly what is in it. There is a website with the lists. What they don't say is how much of each chemical is in it because it's proprietary and they don't want their competition to have their recipe.

There are tests that they can do to see whether methane in someone's water came from the deep shale or if it's naturally occurring shallow methane.

I say frack away.
 

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A 4900 gallon hydrochloric acid spill near Towanda Creek just this week, speaks to the so-called safety of the industry.

Frack away.................if you think your water will be safeguarded by those altruistic drillers.
 

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The biggest problem I have with fracking is that we aren't benefiting from it. From what I understand, It gets sold to the highest bidder, ie. China.
 

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my last job was in Texas delivering frac sand to pressure pumping companies. from my experience it is safe and has the potential to make us energy independant sooner than you might think. there are 3 large shale deposits(plays) in Texas, not including offshore. the most productive is the permian basin. since they started fracking there about 10 years ago it has surpassed the entire state of Alaska for oil production. this past winter North Dakota also surpassed Alaska.
the charges they use to perforate the casing are much larger than a shotgun shell. but as jeff said they go off 10,000 feet down so you don't feel it up near the well head. what you do feel is the pumper trucks. they have large 30 litre diesel engines and there are between 4 and 10 of those trucks running at high RPM pumping the frac fluid.
the jobs are well paying. i made enough money in 6 months to take the rest of the year off.
 

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A 4900 gallon hydrochloric acid spill near Towanda Creek just this week, speaks to the so-called safety of the industry.

Frack away.................if you think your water will be safeguarded by those altruistic drillers.
Chemical storage is not unique to gas drilling so it should not be used as an excuse to stop it. If storage, transportation and containment of any chemical needs to be regulated it should be regulated for every industry that uses it.

The biggest problem I have with fracking is that we aren't benefiting from it. From what I understand, It gets sold to the highest bidder, ie. China.
Chinese people don't come here to do the work. Americans are doing that. My company is benefiting from it by designing new facilities.
 

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This biggest problem with fracking is that all drillers aren't created equal, yet the industry portrays all operators as equally capable.

Do some reading on Chesapeake Energy, and how they're today's Enron in the making, it will open your eyes to what the industry has truly become.

Here's a hint, it's no longer about drilling for gas, it's about flipping leases.
 

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The biggest problem I have with fracking is that we aren't benefiting from it. From what I understand, It gets sold to the highest bidder, ie. China.
i worked with the crude haulers also. the oil went to the refinery or to waiting ships to take it to refineries on the Mississippi river. it would be wouldn't be cost effective to ship it to China when they can get oil from Africa half as far away. we are benefiting from it. have you been tracking the price of natural gas in the past few years. i hate to say this, but when Sarah Palin said "drill baby drill", she was right. and it only took a few years.
 

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This biggest problem with fracking is that all drillers aren't created equal, yet the industry portrays all operators as equally capable.
Agreed. So don't hinder the responsible drillers because of the idiots. Put reasonable regulations in effect and enforce them.
 

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I stand to substantially benefit if and when they drill in NY, but I'm not for drilling without serious oversight and penalties for abuse.

The potential for damage is too huge, and industry "experts" are not an objective source to look towards for those protections.

NY needs the jobs, and I'm for fracking being part of that calculus, but not without concrete safeguards and deterrents in place first.

Here's a recent article on Chesapeake Energy, what many are already calling the next Enron, enjoy.

Chesapeake Gas Reserve Called Into Question - WSJ.com
 

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Jeff, mind PMing me the name of the gas companies in Texas that you worked for or are aware of? I have multiple truck loads of guar gum that I have to move for use in fracking fluids. I only have until Sept until the Guar crops in India are about fully matured, then the market is flooded again. Unless if you know if they scaled down to HEC, HPMC, or Xanthan gum due to the high market price of guar. Haliburton took a shot in the gut over this...
 

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Jeff, mind PMing me the name of the gas companies in Texas that you worked for or are aware of? I have multiple truck loads of guar gum that I have to move for use in fracking fluids. I only have until Sept until the Guar crops in India are about fully matured, then the market is flooded again. Unless if you know if they scaled down to HEC, HPMC, or Xanthan gum due to the high market price of guar. Haliburton took a shot in the gut over this...
PM sent.
 

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My Cousins in P.A. have two wells on their property and the company's involved have been total pro's and safe. Went about a month ago and seen for myself , the safety of the operation is second to none, I was impresed with the whole operation from the multible settling ponds that are lined to the filters that seperate the water , gas and chemicals. Those wells are deep and lined that there is no way that drinking water is affected unless an accident on the surface. However this is not likely to happen because of the multiple precautions that are taken to minimize that risk to almost 0 %. My cousins Live on property and there houses are less than 500 yards from the wells and they are completly happy with the operations conducted over the last two years. DRILL BABY DRILL! LET'S BRING GREAT PAYING JOBS TO N.Y.
 

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I have no idea about whether the drilling is safe or not.

But I do not like the idea of land prices being so high. I am 26 years old, I have a house, a wife, and a baby coming, I want to next buy some land, but the prices in the area are climbing, and older folks holding onto hundreds of acres are tight fisting it and won't sell any because they stand to make a lot of lease money if they decide to drill.

Just one young persons opinion, that being said though. I do concrete work, and if the drillers come here I am sure there will be open bidding on lots of concrete stuff. It's a catch 22, either cheap land and less work, or more work and expensive land.
 

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Just my .02, and I admittedly know little about this issue aside from what I've read, but my thinking is--given that this is NYS--the politicians in Albany won't let this happen until they figure out a way to grab a good share of the loot for the state coffers and their own pockets, up to and including grabbing as much of any revenure garnered by property owners/leaseholders as they can.
We'll see, Eh?
 

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It is not safe, too much room for human errors. All the people thinking they are going to make all this money off these gas companies is a big mistake. You will make your money and they will leave. You know have property nobody wants do to mineral rights. How can you sell a house with a gas lease?

Gas companies are not here for your benefit, the environment or for the economy, they are here simple to fill their greed. When these mini-quakes happen and your foundation cracks or any other damage is done, who do you think pays for it? You do! Also, insurance companies may not insure you do to issues with fracking if you sign a lease. All this hype about how it will alleviate us from foreign energy is a crock. The energy companies are going to ship it to the highest bidder in the world and could care less about this country. Yeah it will create temporary jobs and revenue for land owners for a short period and after that, we are left with the mess.

James
 

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If people had looked at the science behind fracking instead of hyperventilating about all the "dangers" due to fracking, we would be drilling here already. This has been dragging on for four years already...I'm not even sure that the energy companies will come to NYS to drill, most of them have left for Ohio, VA and W VA, where the people want the jobs and the money from drilling...It is increadible the amount of fear mongering that went into keeping landowners in NYS from developing their mineral rights....some of them weren't even from NYS..go figure...It's long past time to drill...any further delay just indicates the state's intent to take all the profit for themselves.:mad:
 

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It is not safe, too much room for human errors. All the people thinking they are going to make all this money off these gas companies is a big mistake. You will make your money and they will leave. You know have property nobody wants do to mineral rights. How can you sell a house with a gas lease?

Gas companies are not here for your benefit, the environment or for the economy, they are here simple to fill their greed. When these mini-quakes happen and your foundation cracks or any other damage is done, who do you think pays for it? You do! Also, insurance companies may not insure you do to issues with fracking if you sign a lease. All this hype about how it will alleviate us from foreign energy is a crock. The energy companies are going to ship it to the highest bidder in the world and could care less about this country. Yeah it will create temporary jobs and revenue for land owners for a short period and after that, we are left with the mess.

James
Maybes and if's..IF you would do your homework, you would know that any development of natural resouces requires that the companies return the site back to what it was before they started....Haven't heard of one landowner who hasn't been able to get insurance...I see alot of places for sale, seems like they still sell for a reasonable price...with or without the mineral rights...there is not one piece of evidence that suggests "mini" earthquakes are a result of fracking....in fact, there is not one shred of evidence suggesting that fracking does anything to any of the wells and surrounding land...it's people like you who have delayed the income to landowners, the jobs to the unemployed, and the tax revenue to the state, and all the while preaching crap like this....I usually find that people who preach this crap don't stand to benifit from the gas exploration...and I find you don't have any problem pulling up to the gas station to fill up your car..as long as it isn't in your backyard, you could care less about where our energy comes from, or who gets hurt getting it....you anti-fracking folks need to study the science, or crawl back under the rock you came from...:mad:
 

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Thanks for the chuckle Mr. Science, the certainty with which you dispensed that garbage is truly hilarious.

The science is hardly settled, contrary to your nonsense.

You cavalierly disregard legitimate environmental concerns, feebly spewing industry propaganda as if it's fact.

Groundwater contamination is a serious risk, and remains so for the entire industry.
 

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Maybes and if's..IF you would do your homework..there is not one piece of evidence that suggests "mini" earthquakes are a result of fracking..................
The USGS does not share your "expert" opinion on fracking related seismic activity.

Did they fail to do their homework as well?

Feel free to put down your shovel at any point.

Fracking Tied to Unusual Rise in Earthquakes in U.S. - Bloomberg

"A naturally-occurring rate change of this magnitude is unprecedented outside of volcanic settings or in the absence of a main shock, of which there were neither in this region," William Ellsworth, Earthquake Science Center staff director for the U.S. Geological Survey
 
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