[androokwomo]

Firstly - mods, feel free to relocate this if it's posted in the wrong place.

OK, beyond that. After my recent shotgun class at IronSight, I spent some time thinking about home defense stuff. Last night, I finally took the time to clear my 2nd floor, which is all I expect I'll ever do during normal times (the cops get called and get to deal with anything downstairs if anything goes bump in the night).

So I took my shotgun through my 2nd floor assuming I had to get to the back bedroom to get a kid or two and secure them in the safe room up front.

I wound up identifying some small tweaks I can do to make that process easier and safer. For example, I can change the angle of the open bathroom door and move the shower curtain just a bit and eliminate some critical blind spots in the process.

Anyone ever done a walk through like this in the dark? What were your results?

 

[vanderblack]

I have walked the entire house, inside and out. I am lucky that my wife keeps a very tidy house. No obstructions while moving about. I made a few adjustments as well. The kitchen table use to stick out into the walk area a little. turning it left a completely clear path. We have a front porch with a roof that is under the upstairs bedroom window on one end. It is very tough to get up on the roof and the windows are secure.. but from inside, it is a good escape route. I installed a hidden fold ladder that can be release to fall to the ground from the roof. Kids have tried it out and have no problem.

I did install additional phones in the house in areas that previously did not have them. Now, regardless of where you are, you can pretty much get to a phone to reach out for help.

Walking through with a shotgun is pretty easy and doing so a few times a year keep it easy.

 

[androokwomo]

Nice. I have a ladder as well. One thing I'm not clear on is if the cops need to enter the house to clear the lower level, I need to find a way to do that. I can easily throw a key attached to a chem light out the window, but they would still need to find a way to get in past the bar. I guess it comes down to them finding out how the bad guy gets in the house in the first place and following.

 

[androokwomo]

I've also found that rotating the shottie 90* (kinda gangsta style) keeps the light and muzzle in alignment and makes point of illumination the same as point of impact.

 

[Uzi]

I've done some "night walks" with the shotgun, but it's really not that practical at such close ranges and such tight rooms. The surrounding neighbors could be hit as well and it's high risk. I have long and short swords which are a better tool in small close quarter defensive situations. If there was a break in in the front door, odds would probably be in my favor if the intruder continued moving in that he would be injured or killed. The tricky situation is if there are more than one and they are all armed. I would need to know what the threat was to act for that specific situation just like anyone else. Unfortunately, a retreat is not even an option sometimes. Hiding and making a move when approached may be the only option so intruders are not alarmed and ready to attack. I'd feel more comfortable disabling someone with a smaller caliper pistol or rifle if I were to use a gun anyways to know it can be managed properly, but the maximum distance is only about 40 feet which I measure at the longest point of my apartment hall. It's more realistically a 10-15 feet distance.

 

[dsdmmat]

.........I have long and short swords which are a better tool in small close quarter defensive situations......

That is the funniest thing I ever read.

My long sword is a rifle and my short sword is a handgun.

I routinely clear the entire house, it is an old house so it makes a lot of noises, I have learned which ones are normal and not but it is still good practice when I am having trouble sleeping. I do not clear the house with a shotgun, too bulky and to easy to get hemmed up in the tight hallway blindspot. A handgun held close to the body and a bright mini flashlight is all that I carry. The every room in the house if pretty well lighted by nightlights so the flashlight is only used when I want to illuminate something odd.

 

[thegatman]

My wife is always complaining about my short sword.

 

[androokwomo]

That is the funniest thing I ever read.

My long sword is a rifle and my short sword is a handgun.

I routinely clear the entire house, it is an old house so it makes a lot of noises, I have learned which ones are normal and not but it is still good practice when I am having trouble sleeping. I do not clear the house with a shotgun, too bulky and to easy to get hemmed up in the tight hallway blindspot. A handgun held close to the body and a bright mini flashlight is all that I carry. The every room in the house if pretty well lighted by nightlights so the flashlight is only used when I want to illuminate something odd.

Yeah, I found what Uzi said odd too, but then saw he was in an apartment. Agree a handgun is a better option if I have to move, however - see my sig line for my thoughts on that in NYS.

 

[dsdmmat]

Yeah, I found what Uzi said odd too, but then saw he was in an apartment. Agree a handgun is a better option if I have to move, however - see my sig line for my thoughts on that in NYS.

Well I arrived in the PRNY with 16 handguns from Germany it was never my intent to set foot in the craphole of a state but the Army has a wierd sense of humor.

 

[Ryan Brownshoe]

I have a video from thunder ranch called defense tactics that really gave some smart information.


One thing i never thought of was hanging mirrors in your house strategically to clear corners of rooms from the outside. The dvd also talks about taking your time and flowing into rooms like water rather than busting in like a bull in a china shop.


It also goes over always having a way to back track if you need to. The last thing you want is to be trapped in an area of a room because you gave up a safe way to retreat if need be. On top of the room clearing it also goes over the use white light, cover and concealment and using obstacles within the room to your advantage.


i would recommend that people check out the thunder ranch training videos and also look into affordable ways to beef up security on your property.

 

[Eternal Shogun]

I've done some "night walks" with the shotgun, but it's really not that practical at such close ranges and such tight rooms. The surrounding neighbors could be hit as well and it's high risk. I have long and short swords which are a better tool in small close quarter defensive situations. If there was a break in in the front door, odds would probably be in my favor if the intruder continued moving in that he would be injured or killed. The tricky situation is if there are more than one and they are all armed. I would need to know what the threat was to act for that specific situation just like anyone else. Unfortunately, a retreat is not even an option sometimes. Hiding and making a move when approached may be the only option so intruders are not alarmed and ready to attack. I'd feel more comfortable disabling someone with a smaller caliper pistol or rifle if I were to use a gun anyways to know it can be managed properly, but the maximum distance is only about 40 feet which I measure at the longest point of my apartment hall. It's more realistically a 10-15 feet distance.

Your long swords are a horrible option for interior use, have you tried effectively swinging one indoors, or are you just figuiring at poking at them with it?

 

[atTheWheels]

I had to do a walkthrough a few months ago at around 3am and found the stairs/landing to be a bit of a pucker moment. Thankfully the sound wasn't coming from my house but a neighbor was doing something at this time of night. A mirror mounted there may do the trick and seems to be a good idea for the blind corner.
Even with the adrenaline going, my thought process and reflex/reaction weren't quite right due to my half awake stupor. That's a priority to me when I evaluate my house and try to map it out for varying circumstances and situations. Not sure how to shake the sleep fog if/when the time comes.

I'm looking at this stuff: 3M Scotchshield Automotive Security Films - Clear and tinted Security films for cars, trucks - 3M Scotchshield
for all my downstairs windows as I believe there are a few installers in the area.
I'm also looking at the door armor kits from here: EZ Armor Ultimate Door Security - Door Jamb Reinforcement - jamb repair - Armor Concepts

The addition of these 2 items IMO can buy me enough delay (if they insist on getting in) to snap out of my stupor and determine my best course of action.

 

[atTheWheels]

Your long swords are a horrible option for interior use, have you tried effectively swinging one indoors, or are you just figuiring at poking at them with it?

Agree, I wouldn't want to be trying to thrust and parry in a house. Motor skills can go to crap in these situations.

 

[ScotchMan]

So the next step for you guys to do is have your wife or your kids go hide in the house before you start clearing, even better if they have nerf guns, squirt guns, or some other sort of "weapon".

Then do your clear and you will see how impossibly difficult it is to succeed against even one entrenched adversary. They will get you every time.

If at all possible, the best plan is to hole up in a safe place with your shotgun and let the police do the clearing. They are better at it, better equipped for it, and its their job. And bonus, if someone needs to get shot that night, it won't be you sitting through years of court hearings.

Clearing a house you know has bad guys in it is a dangerous business; the best option is to avoid it altogether.

 

[zeaken]

a few things i have learned,

short stocks are a must if you want to run a rifle/shotgun

you should be able to operate your firearm with your eyes closed so if something goes wrong you can do something to fix it in the dark. (ie pick a very familiar firearm and preferably one very reliable)

be aware of your ballistics of what your using. you may have children in other rooms or close neighbors.

Keep a med kit strapped do your stock, especially if you don't have easy armor access (have required training)

 

[Eternal Shogun]

Agree, I wouldn't want to be trying to thrust and parry in a house. Motor skills can go to crap in these situations.

You always want smaller quicker blades for indoor use, the samurai understood this well, if the plan is surprising an enemy from a hidden position you technically need no more than a 1" blade or sharpened point to end the conflict immediately....if one knows what they are doing, if you dont you shouldnt be defending yourself with blades in the first place as a primary option.

 

[dsdmmat]

So the next step for you guys to do is have your wife or your kids go hide in the house before you start clearing, even better if they have nerf guns, squirt guns, or some other sort of "weapon".

Then do your clear and you will see how impossibly difficult it is to succeed against even one entrenched adversary. They will get you every time.

If at all possible, the best plan is to hole up in a safe place with your shotgun and let the police do the clearing. They are better at it, better equipped for it, and its their job. And bonus, if someone needs to get shot that night, it won't be you sitting through years of court hearings.

Clearing a house you know has bad guys in it is a dangerous business; the best option is to avoid it altogether.

Clearing a house is not that difficult, the enemy is not entrenched as they are not on home turf. If you know your own house you know where the hiding spots are. Wooden houses are not fun to play hide and wait for the cops to come in shooting. If you want to wait for the cops while someone is ransacking your house or perhaps getting ready to torch it be my guest.

Been practicing room clearing, building clearing, and other smoke the bad guy drills for a very ,very long time. Room clearing drills are better done with paintballs they let you know when you have made a mistake because you feel when you have been shot.

 

[androokwomo]

So the next step for you guys to do is have your wife or your kids go hide in the house before you start clearing, even better if they have nerf guns, squirt guns, or some other sort of "weapon".

Then do your clear and you will see how impossibly difficult it is to succeed against even one entrenched adversary. They will get you every time.

If at all possible, the best plan is to hole up in a safe place with your shotgun and let the police do the clearing. They are better at it, better equipped for it, and its their job. And bonus, if someone needs to get shot that night, it won't be you sitting through years of court hearings.

Clearing a house you know has bad guys in it is a dangerous business; the best option is to avoid it altogether.

Agree 100%. My efforts are focused only on grabbing the kids from their rooms and getting them back to our room (the safe room and escape room). To get there I go by 1 potentially empty room that needs to be crossed safely, the stairwell, and the bathroom. I can't see myself just blindly walking by any of those places so I need to make sure they are at least semi-clear. Once we are all safely back in the safe room, everyone is behind the dresser with me on the side of the bed laying in wait for anyone who tries to break down the door; the police get called and that's it.

 

[ScotchMan]

Clearing a house is not that difficult, the enemy is not entrenched as they are not on home turf. If you know your own house you know where the hiding spots are. Wooden houses are not fun to play hide and wait for the cops to come in shooting. If you want to wait for the cops while someone is ransacking your house or perhaps getting ready to torch it be my guest.

Been practicing room clearing, building clearing, and other smoke the bad guy drills for a very ,very long time. Room clearing drills are better done with paintballs they let you know when you have made a mistake because you feel when you have been shot.

I respectfully disagree. Sure you can know where the hiding spots are. Can you check them all faster than it takes for someone to pop up and shoot you? While checking one of them, can you see all of the other ones all at once? If you can answer yes to either of those questions, I suspect you are forgetting some hiding spots, or you live in an abandoned warehouse.

I am happy to wait for the cops while my house is being ransacked. Nothing I own is worth shooting someone over. People are worth killing over, and possibly firearms are worth killing over, maybe, if they are loaded and left out, but there is nothing like that in my house. So yeah, help yourself to the Xbox and the Blu-ray, I can replace those things a lot easier than a life, and a lot cheaper than a court appearance.

If they are setting fire to my house, that is a different story. I can leave from the bedroom, and would. The house might cost more than a trial, maybe, but its covered under insurance.

 

[dsdmmat]

I respectfully disagree. Sure you can know where the hiding spots are. Can you check them all faster than it takes for someone to pop up and shoot you? While checking one of them, can you see all of the other ones all at once? If you can answer yes to either of those questions, I suspect you are forgetting some hiding spots, or you live in an abandoned warehouse.

I am happy to wait for the cops while my house is being ransacked. Nothing I own is worth shooting someone over. People are worth killing over, and possibly firearms are worth killing over, maybe, if they are loaded and left out, but there is nothing like that in my house. So yeah, help yourself to the Xbox and the Blu-ray, I can replace those things a lot easier than a life, and a lot cheaper than a court appearance.

If they are setting fire to my house, that is a different story. I can leave from the bedroom, and would. The house might cost more than a trial, maybe, but its covered under insurance.

To each his own. If someone is in your house uninvited they are an imminate threat to you and yours. You can handle it the way you want. I will handle it the way I have been trained to.