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Something to consider. Could you hold off 5 men armed with .22 and 30-30 rifles? Or maybe 20 armed only with clubs and a few pistols mixed in. Do you have shooting positions figured out for attacks from all directions. Do the badguys have available cover in the woods shooting distance from your house. Do you have cover? Just wondering if anyone else thinks about this. 99% of my life I exist within 10 miles of my house. If the SHTF, I'm heading home and holding out as long as I can.
 

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I haven't put much thought into it, but I was walking home from work one day, looking around and realized that everything I could see was within rifle range... That got the paranoia going for awhile.
 

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I've thought about it a little in the past, but since they moved a bunch of section 8 housing a few blocks away I figure I'm in the looter fall-out zone, where people'll carry away anything that's less than 200 lbs and not bolted down. Seems like the best thing in that situation would be to hole up indoors on a case of buckshot and wait it out, at least until the bodies seal off any entrances.

I'm just not sure how to tell when it starts. We've been robbed three times now since they did that.
 

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I have given some thought to it somSewhat. Basically what I have come to the realization is that you are still going to be vulnerable to someone sneaking up to a blind spot of your home or apartment and lighting it on fire. So sure you can fend off the first wave of people trying to loot but when they give up trying to take your stuff they may just burn you alive.
 

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well ... I can hold my own against an entire biker bar if that means anything BUT .... no I haven't thought much about it. I just hope for the best. As you can tell I'm more of a spontaneous fellow. :) (don't throw a beer bottle in the vicinity of my fiance, when she was pregnant, and we'll all get along just fine!)
 

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Well, I think about this situation (having to fend off several or more attackers at once), because I encountered this very scenario in my past...

Back about 10 years ago when I was in my early 20s, I found myself in a situation on Transit Rd. near Lockport where 12-14 guys on rice rockets decided to arbitrarily target my vehicle at about 12am (on the way back from my in-laws' home). They were driving rather slowly on Transit (about 30mph is a 55mph zone), and as I came up on them they surrounded my vehicle and proceeded to try and direct me off the side of the road by zipping the rice rockets in front of my '93 Cutlass and braking. A couple of times I basically had to stop because I wasn't sure how bad the situation would escalate if I ran one or more of the guys down, nor did I think my car would necessarily be drive-able after doing so. Most of the time I was able to edge out slowly and continue on my way, still being chased. Eventually I came to a stop light, 6 or 7 guys on rice rockets pulled in front of me blocking me in. My passenger and driver side windows were punched out, as well as my windshield (my cell phone was dialed into 9-1-1 the entire time), I took several jabs in the face/side of the head from inside my vehicle, while one of the guys tried to steal my keys (he had punched out my driver's side window so nearly anything was within his reach). Fortunately I was able to defend the keys and keep them from turning off the ignition and taking the keys. I didn't have any firearms on me, nor did I have a pistol permit. They managed to steal a small cooler out of my car (which had some leftover NY strip steaks - they pulled the cooler right out the passenger side window - I was quite pissed about losing my next day's dinner). At any rate, one of the douchebags must've noticed my phone and flagged the rest of his rice rocket buddies down and took off in a flash. Never saw plates, was kinda tough to look at tiny little 2x4" plates while in a panic with guys going 0-60mph in a few seconds coming from all directions.

Police didn't arrive until I was back at my residence (several Amherst PD cruisers arrived but it was 10-15 minutes after everything had taken place). I have no idea if any of the guys were armed - I'm sure some of them may have had knives, possibly firearms, no idea. All I know was that I didn't want to find out. My plan was to escape, and I'm thankful to this day that it was only me in the car and the wife wasn't a passenger, because I would've handled the matter much more aggressively had she been in the car.

I'm guessing the entire ordeal was some sort of rice rocket gang initiation. It seemed to be planned, but I don't believe it went the way they thought it would. Their goal was seemingly to gain possession of my keys, steal what they could (possibly my wallet, etc.), beat the sh*t out of me, rough up my car, and take off leaving me stuck in my vehicle. Only had a few bruises after all was said and done, nothing broken so technically no felonies. Rice rocket d-bags were never caught.
 

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Them ain't broken fence posts out in the yard, them are range markers...
 

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My greatest fear is while I'm sleeping. Have an alarm system that should provid some time. That said, I live in a colonial style house, with all of the bedrooms upstairs. Often considered locking off downstairs from upstairs internally with a gate of some sort. My wife thinks I'm nuts. I think I'm realistic. Got to move the gun safe from the basement to upstairs. Cruel world we live in these days. Be prepared.
 

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if you holding out in your house, maybe you shouldn't be concerned with 10-20 guys with .22 - but the one guy with the molitov cocktail.
 
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Very few private residences are acceptable for an active defense.

If you apply the military acronym OCOKA to your analysis of your own residence it's likely that you'll learn this to be true.

OCOKA stands for;

Observation and Fields of Fire
Cover and Concealment
Obstacles (man-made and natural)
Key Terrain
Avenues of Approach and Mobility Corridors

There are very few houses that offer good Observation and Fields of fire in all directions. Generally there are large blind spots that simply cannot be observed from inside the house. It will take a substantial number of defenders just to observe those approaches that can be seen. No single person or small family can keep an eye on 360-degrees. Video surveillance could help in this case.

Most residences only offer concealment. There are very few homes that offer real cover from rifle fire. Extensive fortification is required to achieve even a modest level of cover. The threat of fire still remains. (See post about Molotov Cocktails.)

Obstacles around a home may or may not exist. Keep in mind two things; an obstacle is simply and inconvenience to an attacker unless it is covered by fire and observation and any and all obstacles should be placed beyond typical hand grenade range. (See Molotov Cocktails mentioned in a previous post.)

How many of our homes actually occupy Key Terrain in a military sense? Most homes will be found on residential streets with very little in the way of key terrain. One property pretty much looks like the one next door. If your home dominates the local topography in this sense you're in luck.

Generally our residences are placed in the middle of the most sophisticated transportation networks every constructed. We're surrounded by high speed avenues of approach and mobility corridors. If you don't have the capacity to block these and cover those obstacles with observation and fires your defensive position (home) can be swiftly overrun leaving you very little reaction time.

So if your plan is to "hold-up and fight it out" against superior numbers; good luck with that. Your better plan would include a mobile defense that allows you to maneuver and escape if necessary. Defend your home from the outside but this takes planning and training most folks are unaware of.
 

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Hopefully being in a rural area will help with this aspect of home defense. We don't have enough people to defend our home so it is important to try to make it look empty and looted out..:rapid:
 

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Well, I think about this situation (having to fend off several or more attackers at once), because I encountered this very scenario in my past...

Back about 10 years ago when I was in my early 20s, I found myself in a situation on Transit Rd. near Lockport where 12-14 guys on rice rockets decided to arbitrarily target my vehicle at about 12am (on the way back from my in-laws' home). They were driving rather slowly on Transit (about 30mph is a 55mph zone), and as I came up on them they surrounded my vehicle and proceeded to try and direct me off the side of the road by zipping the rice rockets in front of my '93 Cutlass and braking. A couple of times I basically had to stop because I wasn't sure how bad the situation would escalate if I ran one or more of the guys down, nor did I think my car would necessarily be drive-able after doing so. Most of the time I was able to edge out slowly and continue on my way, still being chased. Eventually I came to a stop light, 6 or 7 guys on rice rockets pulled in front of me blocking me in. My passenger and driver side windows were punched out, as well as my windshield (my cell phone was dialed into 9-1-1 the entire time), I took several jabs in the face/side of the head from inside my vehicle, while one of the guys tried to steal my keys (he had punched out my driver's side window so nearly anything was within his reach). Fortunately I was able to defend the keys and keep them from turning off the ignition and taking the keys. I didn't have any firearms on me, nor did I have a pistol permit. They managed to steal a small cooler out of my car (which had some leftover NY strip steaks - they pulled the cooler right out the passenger side window - I was quite pissed about losing my next day's dinner). At any rate, one of the douchebags must've noticed my phone and flagged the rest of his rice rocket buddies down and took off in a flash. Never saw plates, was kinda tough to look at tiny little 2x4" plates while in a panic with guys going 0-60mph in a few seconds coming from all directions.

Police didn't arrive until I was back at my residence (several Amherst PD cruisers arrived but it was 10-15 minutes after everything had taken place). I have no idea if any of the guys were armed - I'm sure some of them may have had knives, possibly firearms, no idea. All I know was that I didn't want to find out. My plan was to escape, and I'm thankful to this day that it was only me in the car and the wife wasn't a passenger, because I would've handled the matter much more aggressively had she been in the car.

I'm guessing the entire ordeal was some sort of rice rocket gang initiation. It seemed to be planned, but I don't believe it went the way they thought it would. Their goal was seemingly to gain possession of my keys, steal what they could (possibly my wallet, etc.), beat the sh*t out of me, rough up my car, and take off leaving me stuck in my vehicle. Only had a few bruises after all was said and done, nothing broken so technically no felonies. Rice rocket d-bags were never caught.
are you on NYspeed? i feel like iv heard a similar story a while back
 

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are you on NYspeed? i feel like iv heard a similar story a while back
Nope, not on that one. I would not be surprised if something similar has happened to others though.
 

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Well, I think about this situation (having to fend off several or more attackers at once), because I encountered this very scenario in my past...

Back about 10 years ago when I was in my early 20s, I found myself in a situation on Transit Rd. near Lockport where 12-14 guys on rice rockets decided to arbitrarily target my vehicle at about 12am (on the way back from my in-laws' home). They were driving rather slowly on Transit (about 30mph is a 55mph zone), and as I came up on them they surrounded my vehicle and proceeded to try and direct me off the side of the road by zipping the rice rockets in front of my '93 Cutlass and braking. A couple of times I basically had to stop because I wasn't sure how bad the situation would escalate if I ran one or more of the guys down, nor did I think my car would necessarily be drive-able after doing so. Most of the time I was able to edge out slowly and continue on my way, still being chased. Eventually I came to a stop light, 6 or 7 guys on rice rockets pulled in front of me blocking me in. My passenger and driver side windows were punched out, as well as my windshield (my cell phone was dialed into 9-1-1 the entire time), I took several jabs in the face/side of the head from inside my vehicle, while one of the guys tried to steal my keys (he had punched out my driver's side window so nearly anything was within his reach). Fortunately I was able to defend the keys and keep them from turning off the ignition and taking the keys. I didn't have any firearms on me, nor did I have a pistol permit. They managed to steal a small cooler out of my car (which had some leftover NY strip steaks - they pulled the cooler right out the passenger side window - I was quite pissed about losing my next day's dinner). At any rate, one of the douchebags must've noticed my phone and flagged the rest of his rice rocket buddies down and took off in a flash. Never saw plates, was kinda tough to look at tiny little 2x4" plates while in a panic with guys going 0-60mph in a few seconds coming from all directions.

Police didn't arrive until I was back at my residence (several Amherst PD cruisers arrived but it was 10-15 minutes after everything had taken place). I have no idea if any of the guys were armed - I'm sure some of them may have had knives, possibly firearms, no idea. All I know was that I didn't want to find out. My plan was to escape, and I'm thankful to this day that it was only me in the car and the wife wasn't a passenger, because I would've handled the matter much more aggressively had she been in the car.

I'm guessing the entire ordeal was some sort of rice rocket gang initiation. It seemed to be planned, but I don't believe it went the way they thought it would. Their goal was seemingly to gain possession of my keys, steal what they could (possibly my wallet, etc.), beat the sh*t out of me, rough up my car, and take off leaving me stuck in my vehicle. Only had a few bruises after all was said and done, nothing broken so technically no felonies. Rice rocket d-bags were never caught.
Hind-sight is 20/20, but drop the clutch and ramming speed man... as soon as a window was broken I'd be ramming my way out of there.
 
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