S&W M&P 15 Sport

[RsynL]

M&P Sport

Just saw that S&W came out with a $709 M&P 15 for 2011 aimed at the first time AR buyer and was curious what people's opinions are on it? I am going to be purchasing my first AR style rifle soon and want to get the best bang for the buck

[Sprout47]

I typically like AR's with things on the end of the barrels.

Kind of turned me off to see the solid trigger guard - other than that at least it is ban state compliant (which makes me wonder a bit as well to be honest).

For the price point I don't think it is a bad deal by any means, I would like to see one in person to decide if it would be worth it though and to make sure nothing other than the trigger guard are unchangeable if one wanted to customize it in the future.

[FrankRochester]

I like it. The only thing I'd do is a free float hand guard. It would probably make a nice all purpose rifle. The 1/8 twist 5 R rifled barrel should be e extremely accurate. You can run some heavy bullets for longer range accuracy.

[Brad@AST]

with a Non chrome lined barrel and the super low price point, it looks to be competing with the CMMG bargain bin guns.

[FrankRochester]

Oops! Didn't notice that until you mentioned it. That would be a deal breaker.

[2011]

....Kind of turned me off to see the solid trigger guard ....

Why? It doesn't seem to bother us on all the other guns we own.

Personally, I hate the guard on my AR, because my midddle finger gets irritated by the removable guard (and the opening it creates).

I like this M&P. No trigger-guard-gap, no chrome-lined barrel (when did chrome-lined become a good thing?), no silly muzzle attachment (are you guys with muzzle devices actually getting any real increase in usablility? Or do you just think they're cool?).

[Sprout47]

Why? It doesn't seem to bother us on all the other guns we own.

Personally, I hate the guard on my AR, because my midddle finger gets irritated by the removable guard (and the opening it creates).

I like this M&P. No trigger-guard-gap, no chrome-lined barrel (when did chrome-lined become a good thing?), no silly muzzle attachment (are you guys with muzzle devices actually getting any real increase in usablility? Or do you just think they're cool?).

Because I would rather have a standard lower (if the forging used isn't a standard forging what else isn't); I use the the Magpul trigger guard.

Chrome lined is good and has been good if one has an aversion to things like rust, pitting and shorter barrel life. Chrome lining is such a good thing the US Government orders it on their rifles and companies like Noveske offer it. Remember these are combat rifles, not precision shooting bench rifles that have their barrels changed around 1,000 rounds through the tube.

Muzzle attachments are quite useful, I am using an A2 flash hider/brake - it offers much more control of the muzzle when firing quickly.

[confused280z]

How many people actually shoot enough to wear out a non chrome lined bore to the point that a 'combat' rifle isn't accurate enough? .223/5.56 is supposed to be very easy on barrels, I have no first hand experience in wearing one out, so I can only parrot others here.

Because the majority of customers are not in a combat situation, why wouldn't they want their fancy new rifle to be very accurate?

My AR had a brake that clamped into a groove on the end of the barrel to be NY compliant. I took it off and am pleased I did, in my case, the brake offered no real advantage but made it uncomfortably loud. This also has the benefit of allowing me to take the gas block/hand guard off.

I think they got this right and will probably sell a bunch to ban states and people looking for a cheap, quality rifle.

[ABSORB]

It also looks like there is no forward assist.

I personally wouldn't get it but that price point is tempting

[Brad@AST]

How many people actually shoot enough to wear out a non chrome lined bore to the point that a 'combat' rifle isn't accurate enough? .223/5.56 is supposed to be very easy on barrels, I have no first hand experience in wearing one out, so I can only parrot others here.

It not only prevents wear but also help protect against elements and general abuse. This is esp true if the user is shooting wolf, and believe me, someone cheap enough to resort to this will be shooting wolf, those two things combined will = lots of trouble down the line.

Because the majority of customers are not in a combat situation, why wouldn't they want their fancy new rifle to be very accurate?

A quality chrome lined barrel will suffer little to no accuracy loss for the typical user.

My AR had a brake that clamped into a groove on the end of the barrel to be NY compliant. I took it off and am pleased I did, in my case, the brake offered no real advantage but made it uncomfortably loud. This also has the benefit of allowing me to take the gas block/hand guard off.

I think they got this right and will probably sell a bunch to ban states and people looking for a cheap, quality rifle.

They will probably sell a bunch. It will just create a huge user base that will need more maintenance. The nice about the no muzzle brake feature is that it makes is super easy to add a FF rail and what not later on.

I wonder if these will have the copious amounts of receiver slop that every M&P I have had the chance to work with has had.

[FrankRochester]

No chrome lining, no forward assist...

YouTube - Fail (with buzzer and losing horns)

[WCKCW]

How many people actually shoot enough to wear out a non chrome lined bore to the point that a 'combat' rifle isn't accurate enough? .223/5.56 is supposed to be very easy on barrels, I have no first hand experience in wearing one out, so I can only parrot others here.

You are correct that the vast majority of civilian shooters will never wear out their AR 15 barrels, whether they are chrome lined or not, but the chrome lining is valuable insofar as it offers corrosion resistance.

While I haven't performed first hand testing on barrel wear, everything I've read has suggested that the 223/5.56, on account of its velocity, is actually harder on barrels than other, slower cartridges.

Like Brad, I have not been impressed by the S&W bargain ARs hitting the market in recent years. How long has it been since S&W had new idea?

[Brad@AST]

I love, love, love the M&P pistol line, but man the AR line is just so meh. They originally had contracted stag to make them, and the few that made it out under that contract are nice from what I have seen.

However the ones made after they backed out the contract are noticeably different.

[sdb3023]

Maybe I am dumb but after reading up on the process that the barrels are treated with and looking at some data from the manufacture and other sources the barrels on these guns should hold just as well as there chromed lined counterparts.

The Melonite process that is applied to the barrel has a significantly better resistance to corrosion, has a lower coefficient of friction and they have a close level of hardness.

Plus the barrel material itself is 4140 which as a chrome content of around 1%, from a materials stand point I guess I just dont see why the barrel is such a deal breaker.

But my opinion is my own, and we all have opinions just like we all have something else.

[Sprout47]

^ 4140 is Chrome-Molly which, while it does have some chromium in the alloy it doesn't exhibit the same corrosion resistance as chrome lining.

As far as the melonite process, it is applied to the outside of the barrel, not the bore. Its the black finish and is commonly used on pistols. So it is not in lieu of chrome-lining its instead of the phosphate finish normally seen on AR barrels.

Which in all honesty - most people won't be hurt by using just a chrome molly barrel, but, if you are the type to goto the range and blow 400 rounds a visit or take a few classes like the magpul dynamics carbine course and run through 2,000 rounds in 3 days then you are going to run into problems. Also, the lack of chrome lining extends to the chamber on this rifle as well - which as history pointed out that is not a good thing as rounds tend to get stuck in non-chromed chambers.

Just some things to consider, as I said I am sure a casual shooter would be pleased with this but the serious shooter or someone intending on getting into shooting heavily should probably look elsewhere.

[demerson]

I wonder if these will have the copious amounts of receiver slop that every M&P I have had the chance to work with has had.

I purchased a S&W MP15FT about a year or so ago ... I see the specs are a little different on it now then the one I have but mine has ZERO slop the tolerances are tight ... I have run the crap out of it .Just sayin'.
That said the one in question does seem bottom of the barrel and the money might be better spent elsewhere .... maybe a lightly used firearm of better quality ?

Ok I just went and looked at the "same" model as the one I purchased a while ago .... all I can say is what the hell .... whomever mentioned the one piece/solid trigger guard was right ... thats just no good .... I don t know what to think ... other than whew! ... I'm glad I got an older one !

[Sprout47]

^ wow Demerson - I didn't even notice that, and they aren't chrome lining the bore/chamber on that one either... wtf over?

[demerson]

specs for new mp15ft:

• Caliber: 5.56 mm NATO
  
• Capacity: 10 Round Detachable Magazine
  
• Action: Semi-Auto
  
• Barrel Length: 16" / 40.6 cm
  
• Barrel Twist: 1 in 8" 5R Rifling
  
• Front Sight: Folding Magpul® MBUS
  
• Rear Sight: Folding Magpul® MBUS
  
• Overall Length: 35" Extended / 32" Collapsed
  
• Stock: Fixed
  
• Weight: 6.85 lbs. / 3,107.1 g
  
• Barrel Material: 4140 Steel
  
• Barrel Finish: Melonite®
  
• Receiver Material: 7075 T6 Aluminum
  
• Receiver Finish: Hard Coat Black Anodized
  
• Chromed Components: Bolt Carrier
  Gas Key
  
• Other Features: Magpul® PMAG
  Magpul® Folding MBUS Sights
  10" Free Float Quad Rail

Specs for old mp15ft:

Caliber: 5.56mm
Capacity: 10 Rounds
Detachable Magazine
Action: Semi-Auto
Barrel Length: 16”
Barrel Twist: 1 in 9”
Front Sight: Troy™ Folding Battle Sight
Rear Sight: Troy™ Folding Battle Sight
Overall Length: 35”
Stock: Fixed Position
Weight: 6.5 lbs.
Barrel Material: 4140 Steel
Receiver Material: 7075 T6 Aluminum
Finish: Hard Coat Black Anodized
Chromed Comp: Barrel Bore, Gas Key
Bolt Carrier, Chamber

[dcruthis]

bushmaster

[Brad@AST]

I purchased a S&W MP15FT about a year or so ago ... I see the specs are a little different on it now then the one I have but mine has ZERO slop the tolerances are tight ... I have run the crap out of it .Just sayin'.
That said the one in question does seem bottom of the barrel and the money might be better spent elsewhere .... maybe a lightly used firearm of better quality ?

Ok I just went and looked at the "same" model as the one I purchased a while ago .... all I can say is what the hell .... whomever mentioned the one piece/solid trigger guard was right ... thats just no good .... I don t know what to think ... other than whew! ... I'm glad I got an older one !

having one with no rock or slop is definitely not the normal, my buddies is nicknamed sloppy sally. lol

[demerson]

having one with no rock or slop is definitely not the normal, my buddies is nicknamed sloppy sally. lol

If you are talking about how the upper and lower mate together .... yeh there isn't any movement ... I lucked out !!!!

[FrankRochester]

bushmaster

Bushmaster = Poo