Almost got arrested today

**GROM** · 05-07-2012, 07:46 PM

I was in Brooklyn subway station waiting for the train while listening to music, and I was wearing an NRA long sleeve shirt. All of the sudden I felt a tap on my shoulder, I turned my head, and saw a badge in my face. The officer right away lifted the right side of the shirt where I carry my knife (HK Ally), and my pen. He saw the clip of the pen, but after he lifted the shirt, he saw the knife clip too, and took it out of my pocket.

First question, "Why do you carry it"
I replied politely, "I carry because it is legal, officer".

I recited the state penal code stating which knives are prohibited, and the city's administrative code that talks about the prohibition of open carry, and the length of a blade. I remembered that some people got arrested even with manual knives after officers were able to flick them open constituting "centrifugal force", and therefore a gravity knife. So the first test the officer did right away was the flick. It opened, and locked. First thought, "oh s***", and I started to shake.

He took my info down, asked what I was doing in Brooklyn (live in Westchester). I said I work at Kings County DA as a computer technician, and showed him my work ID.

He said he will go easy on me, gave me the knife back, and told me to put it in my backpack. I complied, thanked him, shook his hand, got in the train, and went home. It was a close one, and scared the crap out of me. If it had gone the other way, in the worst case scenario I would have been facing a year behind bars.

When I got home, I took out my toolset, and tightened the pivot screw to the max that the knife barely opens. But I don't think I will carry anymore. I'll stick to the pepper spray, which I also had on me, on the left side clipped to the belt. I had had one pepper spray confiscated once because it didn't have labels indicating it is a pepper spray. The one I have also doesn't have any.

Question: What happens with the information he took?

**cgrutt** · 05-07-2012, 08:16 PM

I know what I'm about to post will probably get flamed here but I wouldn't call that almost getting arrested; I'd call it a. NYC LEO doing a good job. From your post, it doesn't seem that you were hasseled (other than being stopped for no apparent reason; OK, I concede that point to the board) at all, he thought there might be a weapon, checked out who you were and sent you on your way. I travelled through Brooklyn subways for seven years and more often than not leaves a lot to be desired. BTW, I always carried a pocket knife (small Spyderco) but always had it in my pocket, not clipped to the pocket or belt. I'm glad nothing happened here and don't know what will happen with the info, but suspect nothing will happen with it. Ok, let the games begin...

**Temporaryscars** · 05-07-2012, 08:21 PM

He did a good job by harassing a law-abiding citizen citing dangerous and unconstitutional laws? Are you out of your mind? Will you say he did a good job when he mops GROM's blood off the train floor when he gets murdered because he couldn't get to his knife and use it properly?

Ughhh, I need to block cgrutt already. His bend-over boot-licking is just blowing my mind.

**Evild** · 05-07-2012, 08:24 PM

Ask my why I'll never step foot in that city.

**Temporaryscars** · 05-07-2012, 08:27 PM

"Why not Evild?! Don't you want the thugs in blue to do a good job all over your skull for having the audacity to think you had the right to protect yourself from harm?!"

**dsdmmat** · 05-07-2012, 08:31 PM

Originally Posted by Evild

Ask my why I'll never step foot in that city.

me either, the state is communist enough for me, the city is just pure fascism.

**Temporaryscars** · 05-07-2012, 08:35 PM

If NY state is communist, then NYC is a gulag.

**Finny** · 05-07-2012, 08:43 PM

I go to NYC now and again with a fixed blade Mora on my belt.Never had a run in with the law.

**de17walt** · 05-07-2012, 08:47 PM

I, would say that he will keep the info on you for a short period of time, if there is no incindent involing a knife within a few days he will have forgotten he even spoke with you. The information will stay with him as he does not have to turn anything in to be offically recorded because there was nothing to record.

**cgrutt** · 05-07-2012, 08:48 PM

Originally Posted by Temporaryscars

He did a good job by harassing a law-abiding citizen citing dangerous and unconstitutional laws? Are you out of your mind? Will you say he did a good job when he mops GROM's blood off the train floor when he gets murdered because he couldn't get to his knife and use it properly?

Ughhh, I need to block cgrutt already. His bend-over boot-licking is just blowing my mind.

Please do. No love lost here.

I'm thinking about the 15 or 20 knifes he pulled off of street punks for every few that he let go. I conceded the point about being stopped for no apparent reason.

**vantrepes** · 05-07-2012, 09:13 PM

Sorry, but exactly how common is a random knifing in NYC? Or armed robbery with a knife?
Sorry, I lack the motivation to dig up the stats myself, but the current "thug" culture doesn't seem to have the knife fascination that the Greasers of the 50's did.

**Temporaryscars** · 05-07-2012, 09:32 PM

I can't speak for NYC, but I'm fairly certain that somebody in Syracuse gets stabbed on a daily basis.

**LMS** · 05-07-2012, 09:57 PM

After reading your post, looking up your knife, and trying to decipher the law, I'm trying to figure out if my CRKT M16 13Z is legal. I thought it was, but seems like one could argue that this clause makes it illegal (the word "centrifugal" seems to be the decider):

"Gravity knife" means any knife has blade which is released from the handle or sheath thereof by the force of gravity of the application of centrifugal force which, when released, is locked in place by means of a button, spring, lever, or other device. [Note: In NYC, and potentially in other NY jurisdictions, this definition is construed to apply to ANY folding knife with a blade that locks open. ]

I found that quote here: http://knife-expert.com/ny.txt

**fastk9dad** · 05-07-2012, 10:25 PM

Originally Posted by GROM

Question: What happens with the information he took?

It likely won't go any further than his notebook.

Every contact you make you get the persons info, you may need it later on for some reason.

If you take a knife into the city, don't leave it clipped to your pocket. In the city an exposed clip is an exposed knife.

N.Y. ADC. LAW § 10-133:

a. Legislative findings.

It is hereby declared and found that the possession in public places, streets and parks of the city, of large knives is a menace to the public health, peace, safety and welfare of the people of the city; that the possession in public places, streets and parks of such knives has resulted in the commission of many homicides, robberies, maimings and assaults of and upon the people of the city; that this condition encourages and fosters the commission of crimes, and contributes to juvenile delinquency, youth crime and gangsterism; that unless the possession or carrying in public places, streets and parks of the city of such knives without a lawful purpose is prohibited, there is danger of an increase in crimes of violence and other conditions detrimental to public peace, safety and welfare. It is further declared and found that the wearing or carrying of knives in open view in public places while such knives are not being used for a lawful purpose is unnecessary and threatening to the public and should be prohibited.

b. It shall be unlawful for any person to carry on his or her person or have in such person's possession, in any public place, street, or park any knife which has a blade length of four inches or more.

c. It shall be unlawful for any person in a public place, street or park, to wear outside of his or her clothing or carry in open view any knife with an exposed or unexposed blade unless such person is actually using such knife for a lawful purpose as set forth in subdivision d of this section.

d. The provisions of subdivisions b and c of this section shall not apply to (1) persons in the military service of the state of New York when duly authorized to carry or display knives pursuant to regulations issued by the chief of staff to the governor; (2) police officers and peace officers as defined in the criminal procedure law; (3) participants in special events when authorized by the police commissioner; (4) persons in the military or other service of the United States, in pursuit of official duty authorized by federal law; (5) emergency medical technicians or voluntary or paid ambulance drivers while engaged in the performance of their duties; or (6) any person displaying or in possession of a knife otherwise in violation of this section when such knife (a) is being used for or transported immediately to or from a place where it is used for hunting, fishing, camping, hiking, picnicking or any employment, trade or occupation customarily requiring the use of such knife; or (b) is displayed or carried by a member of a theatrical group, drill team, military or para-military unit or veterans organization, to, from, or during a meeting, parade or other performance or practice for such event, which customarily requires the carrying of such knife; or (c) is being transported directly to or from a place of purchase, sharpening or repair, packaged in such a manner as not to allow easy access to such knife while it is transported; or (d) is displayed or carried by a duly enrolled member of the Boy or Girl Scouts of America or a similar organization or society and such display or possession is necessary to participate in the activities of such organization or society.

e. Violation of this section shall be an offense punishable by a fine of not more than three hundred dollars or by imprisonment not exceeding

fifteen days or by both such fine and imprisonment.

**CountyCorrectionOfficer** · 05-07-2012, 11:31 PM

Originally Posted by GROM

I was in Brooklyn subway station waiting for the train while listening to music, and I was wearing an NRA long sleeve shirt. All of the sudden I felt a tap on my shoulder, I turned my head, and saw a badge in my face. The officer right away lifted the right side of the shirt where I carry my knife (HK Ally), and my pen. He saw the clip of the pen, but after he lifted the shirt, he saw the knife clip too, and took it out of my pocket.

First question, "Why do you carry it"
I replied politely, "I carry because it is legal, officer".

I recited the state penal code stating which knives are prohibited, and the city's administrative code that talks about the prohibition of open carry, and the length of a blade. I remembered that some people got arrested even with manual knives after officers were able to flick them open constituting "centrifugal force", and therefore a gravity knife. So the first test the officer did right away was the flick. It opened, and locked. First thought, "oh s***", and I started to shake.

He took my info down, asked what I was doing in Brooklyn (live in Westchester). I said I work at Kings County DA as a computer technician, and showed him my work ID.

He said he will go easy on me, gave me the knife back, and told me to put it in my backpack. I complied, thanked him, shook his hand, got in the train, and went home. It was a close one, and scared the crap out of me. If it had gone the other way, in the worst case scenario I would have been facing a year behind bars.

When I got home, I took out my toolset, and tightened the pivot screw to the max that the knife barely opens. But I don't think I will carry anymore. I'll stick to the pepper spray, which I also had on me, on the left side clipped to the belt. I had had one pepper spray confiscated once because it didn't have labels indicating it is a pepper spray. The one I have also doesn't have any.

Question: What happens with the information he took?

It's also against the NYC Administrative Code for you to possess or carry PEPPER SPRAY or MACE as well even though the possession of such items is legal in the NYS Penal Law for private citizens.

**meketrefe** · 05-08-2012, 12:34 AM

Newyorken iste liven under thir reich commandem!!.
Scrujen fukeing Mayorg Blumbergen !!!

**usmcveteran** · 05-08-2012, 04:23 AM

Worst case I guess he might use your info to verify you work where you say you do. You have to be careful in NYC from what I read. I guess some cops there if they can't flick it open the normal way they will hold it by the blade then flick the handle open. I cant find the article but if you can find the one about the raids police conducted in 2003 (I think) where they confiscated knives from stores in NYC its a good read.

**GROM** · 05-08-2012, 06:10 AM

Originally Posted by CountyCorrectionOfficer

It's also against the NYC Administrative Code for you to possess or carry PEPPER SPRAY or MACE as well even though the possession of such items is legal in the NYS Penal Law for private citizens.

You're right. I just searched for it, and a pepper spray falls under the definition of "tear gas".
10-131e

e. Tear gas; sale or possession of; fees for permits. 1. It shall be unlawful for any person to manufacture, sell or offer for sale, possess or use, or attempt to use, any lachrymating, asphyxiating, incapacitating or deleterious gas or gases, or liquid or liquids, or chemical or chemicals, without a permit issued by the police commissioner under such regulations as the commissioner or the council may prescribe; nor shall any person manufacture, sell or offer for sale, possess or use any weapon, candle, device, or any instrument of any kind designed to discharge, emit, release or use any lachrymating, asphyxiating, incapacitating or other deleterious gas or gases, or liquid or liquids, or chemical or chemicals, without a similar permit, similarly issued, except that the members of the police department in the line of duty may possess or use any such gas, liquid or chemical.

**coolbreez67** · 05-08-2012, 07:15 AM

OK....someone correct me if I'm wrong. I know you said he saw the clip for your pen. But it actually could have been anything. Isn't lifting your shirt up an illegal search? Did the fact that he saw the clip for the pen give him a reasonable suspicion that you could be carrying a gun?

**ChrisWNY** · 05-08-2012, 07:28 AM

Wow...so everyone in NYC is subject to random, at-will pat-downs by the NYPD for concealed weapons, regardless of whether or not there is "reasonable suspicion" to do so? Was glad to read however that the NYPD officer let the OP go without too much hassle. Bloomdouche is definitely a nazi, and he's running the gestapo over in NYC.

**fastk9dad** · 05-08-2012, 07:36 AM

Originally Posted by coolbreez67

OK....someone correct me if I'm wrong. I know you said he saw the clip for your pen. But it actually could have been anything. Isn't lifting your shirt up an illegal search? Did the fact that he saw the clip for the pen give him a reasonable suspicion that you could be carrying a gun?

He wasn't looking for a gun, he saw the pen clip and suspected it was a knife - which turned out to be next to it.

**hudsonvalley** · 05-08-2012, 07:41 AM

I recently had a disposable dental pick in my pocket, you know... the ones with the 'one time use' mint flavored dental floss hooked on one end ....and, I just...forgot it was in my pocket, I swear. You see, my wife had just made some ribs and I ate them too fast....didn't give myself a full chew on that seasoned piece of pork belly....if I had chewed better, there would of been no need for the toothpick...I mean dental pick. So, there I was...in a rush to leave and get to work...I was on third shift, didn't want to go, but the economy being in the hole, I had no choice... and no time to floss, so, I grabbed one of those disposable thingys and threw it in in my pocket...forgot about it really until I was in the station, digging for change and it bit me...drew blood....PD saw my expression...and the blood....before I knew it he was on his radio calling for back up. Then it happened! I heard the A Train pulling in... My eyes shifted from this servant of the people to the turnstile....should I go for it....could I make it?

Sorry, way too much time and caffeine on my hands...

**ChrisWNY** · 05-08-2012, 08:05 AM

Consider yourself lucky, hudsonvalley, you could've faced a 20 yr to life sentence for being found in possession of a disposable dental pick. Have no idea how you managed to get a hold of a dental pick anywhere near NYC as Bloomdouche has banned them all.

**Steve-o** · 05-08-2012, 08:26 AM

Fast K9Dad is 100%. For the record, it is called a UF 250. Google it. The Cop was doing his job and doing it well. I will just leave it at that. Bash the administration, not the working man.

This is not easy, but I will just leave it there. Hit Google and be enlightened.

**BUCKrub91** · 05-08-2012, 08:47 AM

Originally Posted by cgrutt

I know what I'm about to post will probably get flamed here but I wouldn't call that almost getting arrested; I'd call it a. NYC LEO doing a good job. From your post, it doesn't seem that you were hasseled (other than being stopped for no apparent reason; OK, I concede that point to the board) at all, he thought there might be a weapon, checked out who you were and sent you on your way. I travelled through Brooklyn subways for seven years and more often than not leaves a lot to be desired. BTW, I always carried a pocket knife (small Spyderco) but always had it in my pocket, not clipped to the pocket or belt. I'm glad nothing happened here and don't know what will happen with the info, but suspect nothing will happen with it. Ok, let the games begin...

your joking right?